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How to make Aircraft Loiter

 
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Deathblow



Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 392

PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:18 pm    Post subject: How to make Aircraft Loiter Reply with quote

How do I make an aircraft trail and loiter over the CVSG that its supposed to be protecting. For example, I've set up an E3-Hawkeye as an inflight aircraft for my Carrier to extend the radar coverage, and I would like it to just continue to loiter right over the carrier as it goes thru its maneuvers.

I try using the standard "boxes" but it usually gets the Hawkeye in trouble, because the box is usually too small and the CV will eventually move beyond it, resulting in suboptimal radar coverage by the hawkeye. I've also tried making an extensive box that the CV will never go beyond, but that also causes trouble because the hawkeye will go beyond the carriers AAW range too quickly and be at risk to be attacked.

The game doesn't really allow us to add the aircraft to a formation... Anyone got any tricks or ideas?
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LuftWolf



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 1872
Location: Free New York

PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd recommend a "rolling respawn."

You can set an area trigger on the CVBG to fire a remove trigger on the first S-3 and then fire a add object trigger for new S-3's on the way.

There is also a doctrine level command called TacticCenter, that might also be available in the mission editor scripts, try looking for it and see if you can script it for the S-3 based on a refiring area trigger for the CVBG, that would be a more elegant solution, but it might not be available, of course.
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Molon Labe



Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 1052
Location: Bloomington, IN, USA

PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there an option for an air station? Hmmm, what tactic would be assigned for that...?

You might just have to use a lot of waypoints otherwise...
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Deathblow



Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 392

PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LuftWolf wrote:
I'd recommend a "rolling respawn."

You can set an area trigger on the CVBG to fire a remove trigger on the first S-3 and then fire a add object trigger for new S-3's on the way.


Looks like that may be the only option :shifty: Confused .
Plus maybe some option to spawn another E3 with the first is destroyed, the CV launched another aircraft to replace the E3 but ahead of another E3 it was a F18.... not quite what's needed for battlefield radar surveillance.... :8Cool

Work it progress to get this all right. Makes coordinating a *reasonably* oschestrated CVSG pretty much a jimmy-rigg with overly complicated micromanagement scripting.
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LuftWolf



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 1872
Location: Free New York

PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Making missions is hard..." [whine] Razz

Come on, be a man. Cool Smile
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Miika



Joined: 10 Oct 2005
Posts: 60
Location: Helsinki

PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:03 am    Post subject: A Suggestion Reply with quote

Use a trigger, set to re-trigger constantly, that orders the aircraft to "follow/track?... CV". (Can't remember the exact trigger.) I've used it and it works, although it needs some fine-tuning to work.

Miika
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nzm30



Joined: 25 Dec 2001
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The last time I tried it (some time ago, but it worked) was to use 'air station'.
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Deathblow



Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 392

PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LuftWolf wrote:
"Making missions is hard..." [whine] Razz

Come on, be a man. Cool Smile


But.... but.... it *IS* hard Sad Embarassed . Getting these captains and pilots to act right is sometimes like trying to get a 2 year old to eat brussel sprouts. Damn ah well, WIP, will keep trying

Miika wrote:
Use a trigger, set to re-trigger constantly, that orders the aircraft to "follow/track?... CV". (Can't remember the exact trigger.) I've used it and it works, although it needs some fine-tuning to work.


Thanks Miika I'll give it a try.

nzm30 wrote:
The last time I tried it (some time ago, but it worked) was to use 'air station'.


I'll try that as well. Thanks

My ultimate goal is to create a template script for CVSG so that they behave and respond appropriately to most attacks/enemies so that in the future, whenever a CVSG is needed in a mission, the scripts, triggers, tatics, and groups have already been worked out.

So far stuff that I need to work out is...
1. Consistent utilization of the E3-Hawkeye as its appropriate EAW platform. The CV should also re-launch a new Hawkeye appropriately whenever the current one gets shot down. Have to work out a reasonable scripts, maybe a trigger as Miika or Nzm suggested above to get the Hawkeye to fly right and then a spawn trigger with a time delay whenever the current hawkeye is downed.... maybe. It should probably always be escorted with fighter responding appropriately.
2. Appropriate use of air strikes, not just two or three fighters flying above, but maybe a trigger to spawn a figher wing of 8-10 planes whenever a enemy reaches X nm and is properly detected (either positively identified, or even just a scant ambiguous sensor contact if the threat levels are high enough). The strike group would have to be able to fly in, attack a target and then return to base afterwards. Gotta work out the triggers as well.
3. Escorts that act like escorts. Shouldn't be too hard, but sometimes I see the DG and CG actually going the other way from the CV they are supposed to be escorting! Surprised Stare :hulk: , WIP

hm... that should probably do it for starters. Will take awhile to work it out, but hopefully will be a nice template for whenever a CVSG is needed in future scenarios. Got some campaign ideas that should be interesting and replayable.
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Deathblow



Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 392

PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's what I've found so far.

The Airstrip is great for E2-Hawkeye loitering where you want the plane, but its not good for scripting the plane to do any other actions (basically beyond all commands). Additionally, whenever the plane is shot down another one is not launched to replace it.

In order to script the launching of a replacement Hawkeye, the best thing I've found so far is a script tags to the demise of the original Hawkeye that will script a another Hawkeye launch. Then too my chargin, Hawkeye launches are broken and they physically can not launch off the carriers with the current physics model (their launch velocity is too low and then crash into the ocean) not a problem for jet launches, but precludes the Hawkeye launches. Additionally, its hard to predict what the behavior of the replacement Hawkeye will be since its beyond scripting.

Perhaps the best Hawkeye, loiter techinique may be just the creation of 1 in flight Hawkeye, and 3 dynamic groups, each with a Hawkeye, scripted to spawn when the last Hawkeye went down (perhaps with a 15min time delay). But that leaves the problem of "where do they spawn?" Given that a mission might cover 100miles or so, a spawn point could be far outside the range of the carrier if the game is fairly underway..... perhaps some scripting to ensure that the respawned Hawkeye seek out and follow the nearest carrier, but the details aren't well worked out and its hard to tell if it will work.

Still WIP, will keep posting on possible solutions.
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FERdeBOER



Joined: 27 Mar 2002
Posts: 189
Location: España (Spain)

PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That was many months ago and I don´t remember exactly, but, when creating a mission (never finished) and tried to make what you want of aircraft launched when something happens (detect a task force in my case) I found that the aircrafts must be on flight alert (with right click on the aircraft and "flight schedule" if I remember well).

Then, the aircrafts will launh on the time schedulled.

Hope this helps.
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Deathblow



Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 392

PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hm... ok I'll give it a try to see what comes up. I ran into a little problem earlier when I discovered that the current physics engines keeps E2's from launching from the carrier. They go straight into the ocean. :doh: Stare Confused

Maybe with some tweaking and the launching problem resolved it can be the simple solution we're looking for.
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MaHuJa



Joined: 10 Jan 2002
Posts: 447
Location: 59.96156N 11.02255E

PostPosted: Mon May 01, 2006 11:14 pm    Post subject: Re: How to make Aircraft Loiter Reply with quote

Deathblow wrote:
I would like it to just continue to loiter right over the carrier as it goes thru its maneuvers.


Educated guessing galore:

I believe USN doctrine specifically states that an E-2 should not do that. Simply because that would pretty much be to tell the enemy "we're here" well beyond the radar horizon of the ship itself.

On the other hand, the mission editor tends to place the E-2 well below standard operating altitude, giving it a rather close radar horizon. Placing it higher and further away might still give it better radar coverage to the opposite side than it would have low and close.

Perhaps you won't need to have it move its station.
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Bellman



Joined: 14 Feb 2004
Posts: 1724

PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2006 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Standard Harpoon E2 practise is for the aircraft to depart low in emcon and remain so until a standoff position
is attained possibly over 40 nm abeam the carrier. The aircraft then climbs as high as necessary to achieve the
desired radar coverage.

E2 position is a signpost to the carriers so great care is taken not to follow patterns of behaviour nor
to interpose the E2 between the carrier and any potential platform or radar coverage threat.
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