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Deamon
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 2302
Location: Germany
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 Posted: Thu Apr 08, 2004 7:21 pm Post subject: Some more screenies |
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Back again with some more stuff,
have made a few more pics that looked nice and i thought i should show you them.
Deamon |
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Hitman
Joined: 14 Sep 2002
Posts: 3059
Location: Spain
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| Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 4:51 am Post subject: |
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What a BLAST!!!  
Riding this submarine will be a tremendous fun, even if there were no other ships to shoot at....
The love for the detail is simply outstanding.....
I´m looking forward to take a ride on it. Deamon, you should consider making a first realease of your sim with just the sub, the home base and harbour, and may be some civilian traffic. Just to learn well how to use the sub.
You can later expand and have the sub go to war, but a first part of the sub representing commisioning and peace-time training ( Including siome torpedo and gun shooting ) would already be something to spend hours at, and a good training for the war time.
Cheers |
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Seeadler
Joined: 14 Mar 2001
Posts: 1992
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 8:41 am Post subject: |
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| Are that render pics or really ingame? |
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Deamon
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 2302
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 8:51 am Post subject: |
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I know you would ask that  They are still rendernings.I just experimented a little bit with shadows and lights and found that they look nice and thought i post them.Against all expectations i'm still mutch in the resurch and 3D modeling phase.When i'm finished with all the driveables than i leav 3D modeling for a while and start with the demo.
EDIT: BTW: What do you think,cause this some feelings ?
Deamon
Last edited by Deamon on Sat May 01, 2004 7:50 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Deamon
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 2302
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 10:29 am Post subject: |
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| Hitman wrote: | What a BLAST!!!
Riding this submarine will be a tremendous fun, even if there were no other ships to shoot at....
The love for the detail is simply outstanding.....
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I must admit that i'm surprized a bit also and pleased with the result.Yes,you will be amazed to finde out how functioning the boat will be.The driving and diving alone should be great fun.That's my approach to it.It will just take it's time to implenent all this.
NOTE: there are still lots of small details to add to this model.
| Quote: |
I´m looking forward to take a ride on it. Deamon, you should consider making a first realease of your sim with just the sub, the home base and harbour, and may be some civilian traffic. Just to learn well how to use the sub.
You can later expand and have the sub go to war, but a first part of the sub representing commisioning and peace-time training ( Including siome torpedo and gun shooting ) would already be something to spend hours at, and a good training for the war time.
Cheers |
You can read my minde huh ? :huh: How could you guessed that ? 
That's exactly the plan.When i'm arrived at that point with the development than i think to release a Demo where you take part on the comissioning of the first german war submarine,at the Yard first and than follows what is called "Baubelehrung" in german,don't know the proper term in English.Basicaly it's a brief indeapth introduction from the Yard engineers of the whole sub for you and your crew.In the submarine detachment of the naval academy you will learn than all the basics about the diving and manouvering,rules of the road,navigating and other Nautical stuff.You will learn all the savety precautions and rules,especial for diving,you know there are extra savety rules in peacetime and you will have to follow them and need them.You will learn about all the hazards of diving and the hazards that an old petrolium sub contains.You will have to learn to handle all thous hazards that just may occure.You will have to drill your crew so that they become fast and reliable.
Everything starts with trials on the surface in harbour waters.Than comes various exercise drives where you train the nautical and navigating stuff that you learned in the academy.Than when you finished with all the surface training than comes the serious part of your training; DIVING.At the beginning in very shallow water a few miles away from the harbour(due to savety precautions).There is always an escorting torpedoboat that assist you and that can give you first aid immediately in case of emergency like mark your position with bouys,contact the base for further help,keep contact with you via the telefon from the rescue bouy that you can release from your sub and there are some more rescue instalations and proccedures to bring you back to the surface(you will see when i'm done).
When the confidence and experiance grows,you move out in heavy seas for diving exercises and navigating at PD in heavy seas.You must realy know how to dive in heavy seas or you will end up in a very hazardous situation.But you will learn all this stuff in the virtual academy before you go out for live exercise.
After all the basic training is finished comes the tactical training.When you done with everything you will be promoted and get your assignment as the commander of U1
Some peace time patrols follows where you can slowly accomodate your self with your new commanding role and gather further experiance with all that you have learned make more drills for your crew,learn to navigate better in your coastile waters.Than the more exiting part where you participate in naval manouvers with firing exercise torpedos at your mates and stuff.During the manouvers you have the oppurtunity to fully accomodate your self with the various mission areas of a submarine.This manouvers are the highlights of your training and will give you the edge that a "real" sub commander should have
Than the world turns in to the pre war state and thigs get hot and the mood get cold.Rules of engagement turns in to the proper prewar state and coastile protection becomes a serious issue.More fleet manouvers are being conducted than usual.Occasionaly you will be sending out close to enemy waters and harbours to shadow the enemy fleets(your first real mission),observe their activities and report them back,looking for their weak points and stuff.This are your first opportunities to accomodate your self with the enemy and enemy waters(with out being in real danger).Things get more and more hot and finaly the war breakes out.Now it's serious.Before every patrol you move out with some escorts and your flotilla commander in remote coastile waters closer to the open waters and undergo some test dives and savety precaution proceedures surface again come along the yacht of the flotilla commander and report the result.If no problems did occured than you are released for the patrol and ther you go.
Since U1 is being made for only limited coastile operations you will being assigned as the commander of one of the new and fine subs >U31< U1 goes back to the academy to serve as training boat for new crews,that means if you didn't wasted it already U31 should be appropriate for all your briliant skills you gained so fare and open waters operations
Later you will take command of one of the sub cruisers and than your travel leads you to the Amercan coast."Hallo america,greetings from imperila germany" 
All the war and prewar stuff is of course out of the scope of the demo.But should only portraits the design goal of the long term development.
If it will become what i aim for than you will realy NEED some brief training before you can go to war.
My goal is basicaly to acommodate the player slowly step by step with all aspects of submarining.You aren't being exposed to the full hazard of the war after like three training missions(but optionaly you can of course).This is the point that i'm most disapointed about in almost all other sims.There are no comprehensive step by step trainig kampaigns,no virtual academys.You start with the war kampaign way too soon and being killed dozens of times and start all over again.And this trial and error approach is i think that what destroys the feeling of being there more than anything else.
I want to do this the other way this time.Basicaly i won't let out every effort to pull the player in to the sub.It's a different kinde of playing experiance when you have undergone a comprehensive,challenging and very educational training in the virtual naval academ before you enter the war.You enter the war battleprooven through many manouvers and exercises.You know your capeabilities,you know the skills of your crew,you know where your and your crews limits are.You know the limits of your mashine and what it's capeable of.You enter the war with confidence and that should let you act decisevly,like a real command should do.And than you can make a valuable contribution to extend the Imperial Reich LOLOLOL 
A triple "Hurray" on the Imperator.So fare about my new imperial attitude
And don't worry Hitman,when i'v done a demo you will be surly one of the first who will get in touch with it. :wink:
It was worth to resurch for sutch a long time and so intens.I gathered realy unique and rar stuff here.That i have never seen in any naval simulation before.
EDIT: Commets about this approach are velcome
Cheers
B.d.U. Deamon |
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america person
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 1309
Location: fairfax, VA, near D.C
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| Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| nice idea with the trianing and what not it would be worth it to KNOW what your doing and why ya know like why dive no and not later etc etc |
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Deamon
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 2302
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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LOL
Strange gramatic.Not sure whether i did understand you right.
Deamon |
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skriblz
Joined: 10 Jan 2002
Posts: 286
Location: Philadelphia, PA
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| Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Deamon wrote: | LOL
Strange gramatic.Not sure whether i did understand you right.
Deamon |
He said the trainings a good idea so there's no clueless newbs.
.........................i guess. |
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FUBAR295
Joined: 27 Mar 2002
Posts: 541
Location: Decks awash in the North Atlantic
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| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 12:08 am Post subject: |
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Deamon,
Very nice renderings. Been following your development stage for a while. Cannot wait to see your complete model and the demo. It shows you've done a lot of research.
Super job!
Good Hunting,
FUBAR |
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Hitman
Joined: 14 Sep 2002
Posts: 3059
Location: Spain
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| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 4:31 am Post subject: |
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EDIT: Oops,sorry.I accidentaly editedt your post.Forgot that i'm the moderator here LOL
| Quote: | | You can read my minde :huh: ? How could you guessed that ? |
Because I am spanish but had german education in school
As for the SIM: I love this approach. If you want to go for real hardcore, then you must accept that a naval officer needed years of training to be able to command a U-Boat.But the most important thing -in my opinion- that will tell how good is the sim, is the way the environment responds to non-programmed tactics and actions. For example, if you make the sub manouver or apply techniques that were not inititally considered in the sim,it CAN happen that however they give the desired effect.AS LONG as the water model, sound model, physics, etc. of the engine are good and detailed enough.And I guess your sim will be a real success in that questions, given the amount of research that lies behind it.
I´m looking forward to see a demo, and be able to help by creating missions once the sim reaches the proper state for it.
Cheers Deamon |
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Deamon
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 2302
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:44 am Post subject: |
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Because I am spanish but had german education in school
When I was still at school, 10 years ago, and made my "Abitur" I really was able to think in german, and sometimes I even dreamed in german Total inmersion, they call this...LOL
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So so.
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As for the SIM: I love this approach. If you want to go for real hardcore, then you must accept that a naval officer needed years of training to be able to command a U-Boat.
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Yes,and how comprehensive the training campaign will be is something that needed be to experimeted out.I surly don't want to spoil the casual gamer and single quick training missions will be available also.I will notifie you when i'm arrivied at that point and will send you a CD for testing.
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But the most important thing -in my opinion- that will tell how good is the sim, is the way the environment responds to non-programmed tactics and actions. For example, if you make the sub manouver or apply techniques that were not inititally considered in the sim,it CAN happen that however they give the desired effect..
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Not quite sure what you mean.You mean on how well the AI responds to the players actions ?
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..AS LONG as the water model, sound model, physics, etc. of the engine are good and detailed enough.And I guess your sim will be a real success in that questions, given the amount of research that lies behind it.
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And there is still a huge ammount of resurch in front of me  But yes every part of the engine will get the same attention as the grafical details of my models.Authenticie in all regards is my personal goal and taste,i mean everything about this project is authenticie authenticie authenticie,especialy sound and environment effects,not just to make a good sim for others but to make a sim for my self that i always dreamed about.That's why i do all the resurch and still had no time to do the actual game :shifty: I want to make sure that this will not be just another subsim.
But you recognized it right,the ammount of ditails on my models is the direct result of all the resurch.
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I´m looking forward to see a demo, and be able to help by creating missions once the sim reaches the proper state for it.
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Thanks for your support,moders will be always welcome.But i don't think that the campaign will be made out of linear missions.I think to go straight forward to a fully dynamic kampaign.But i surly will add the possibilitie of creating single missions and campaigns that consist of single missions.Infact this will be the first possibilitie on that i will work on,also for the demo.
Ok,time for me go back and continue to model the new cruiser.
BTW: Do you know the book "Riders of the Deep" ?
Deamon
Last edited by Deamon on Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:57 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Deamon
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 2302
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:51 am Post subject: |
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Thanks,FUBAR.
EDIT: How do you like the WWI idea ?
Deamon |
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Hitman
Joined: 14 Sep 2002
Posts: 3059
Location: Spain
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| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 7:00 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Quote:
But the most important thing -in my opinion- that will tell how good is the sim, is the way the environment responds to non-programmed tactics and actions. For example, if you make the sub manouver or apply techniques that were not inititally considered in the sim,it CAN happen that however they give the desired effect..
Not quite sure what you mean.You mean on how well the AI responds to the players actions ?
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No, not exactly the AI, but the responses of the environment itself to your actions.
I have seen this well done in some car racing sims with very advanced physics, like Mobil1 Rally Champ: F.e. no programmer ever thought of allowing a car to run on the two wheels of the right, while the other two of the left are up in the air ( You might have seen it done by professional stunts in some films ), or making inverted turns ( Full speed back, then full rotation with locked front wheels ), BUT because the game´s physics are very accurate to the real thing, if you make those manouvers in the simulator, the resulting behaviour of the car is exactly the same as it would be in real life.
And I suppose that with your sim, the same will happen. Any manouver or action a real captain had done, will have in the sim the same results it would have had in real life, if it had been done.
Cheers |
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AdamWarren
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 3013
Location: The same as the last 23 hours... staring at the monitor TN, USA
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| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 7:03 am Post subject: |
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| Hitman wrote: | | EDIT: Oops,sorry.I accidentaly editedt your post.Forgot that i'm the moderator here LOL |
HUH? I don't see your name on here.... Wait a sec... Your a "Super mod"? (Yeah, ok, I'm one to... er... just not here.. )
Deamon, this looks better & better all the time! Keep it up man! |
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Deamon
Joined: 30 Apr 2002
Posts: 2302
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| Hitman wrote: | | Quote: |
Not quite sure what you mean.You mean on how well the AI responds to the players actions ?
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No, not exactly the AI, but the responses of the environment itself to your actions.
I have seen this well done in some car racing sims with very advanced physics, like Mobil1 Rally Champ: F.e. no programmer ever thought of allowing a car to run on the two wheels of the right, while the other two of the left are up in the air ( You might have seen it done by professional stunts in some films ), or making inverted turns ( Full speed back, then full rotation with locked front wheels ), BUT because the game´s physics are very accurate to the real thing, if you make those manouvers in the simulator, the resulting behaviour of the car is exactly the same as it would be in real life.
And I suppose that with your sim, the same will happen. Any manouver or action a real captain had done, will have in the sim the same results it would have had in real life, if it had been done.
Cheers |
Ok,that's what you mean.Let me tell you this,i concentrated once my resurch efforts on to this area since i think it's one of the soils of a realistic sim and succed to finde some very comprehenssive documents that encompasses most of the physics and proper manouvering stuff that may occure on the surface.Also i could extract alot of information about the diving physics that most of the people aren't aware of,as i belief.I have some surprises in this regards.I have all basics about the diving physics and some very unknown aspects of diving,it's also already comprehensive.
There are also interactions betwin some physical properties and tactics,that of i never heard anything before.I will always continue to colect informations in this regard and if anything new pop up i will investigate it and implement it.
Physics are for me a serious thing,as serious as aerodynamics and thermodynamics for flight sims,to answer your question.It's for a WWI sim even more important since ramming was still very popular in this time.
Deamon |
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